Wednesday, March 6, 2013

Genesis 3: Evicted for Eating Fruit

Check out today's episode

The Fall (v. 1-24)

The serpent was the craftiest creature God had made, he asked Eve if she was forbidden from eating any fruit in the garden, she replied that she was not allowed to eat the fruit from that one tree, if she did she would die.

That answers the question from yesterday, Eve certainly did understand that she was not allowed to eat the forbidden fruit. Whether God repeated himself or Adam passed on the message doesn't really matter, the point is she understood.

Guzik says that while it is not explicitly stated that this is Satan, it is pretty clear. Seems reasonable to me. He goes on to say
Eve’s first mistake was in even carrying on a discussion with the serpent. We are called to talk to the devil, but never to have a discussion with him. We simply and strongly tell him, “The Lord rebuke you!” (Jude 1:9)
That's hilarious, this very idea is designed to keep people in their own little bubble, you aren't even supposed to communicate with people of an opposing viewpoint.

The serpent told Eve that she would not die if she ate the fruit, her eyes will be open and she will be like God in that she will know good and evil.

The serpent is actually being truthful here, God lied when he said she'd die.

Guzik goes on at length about how Satan was contradicting God and how Satan was evil for this. He never addressed the fact that God was indeed lying.

She saw that the fruit looked good, was good to eat, and would grant wisdom, she took the fruit and ate it, she also gave some to Adam and he had some. Their eyes were opened, they realized they were naked and they made themselves loincloths out of fig leaves.

Doesn't really seem like it took that much to get her to eat the fruit. Also, it didn't take that much convincing to get Adam to eat it with her. I remember watching cartoons of this scene when I was a kid, they really expanded this part a lot. I seem to recall Adam trying to resist and her insisting. Wish I could remember better, damn fuzzy childhood memories.

Also, we have this naked thing again. Why is this suddenly a big deal? Understanding good and evil makes the ashamed of being naked? What?

Adam and Eve heard God walking through the garden and they hid from him in the bushes.

I love the idea of God taking a stroll.

God called out to Adam asking him where he was, Adam responded that he hid because he was naked.

I can imagine people asking why God would have to ask this question, and claim it shows he's not omnipotent. However, it is possible God is humoring Adam. Think of a father looking for his son in the house, he probably knows where the kid is, and still calls out for him to come out on his own.

God asks Adam how he knows he is naked and asks if he ate the fruit. He says yes, and that Eve gave him the fruit. Eve says that the serpent tricked her.

I remember this was a big thing when I was a kid. I can still hear my dad saying "everyone's passing the buck". This is true, but they are also explaining what happened.

Whoa, Guzik gives Eve credit saying that she wasn't necessarily shifting blame to the serpent as much as she was explaining that she was deceived. But then he goes on to say
The only problem comes when we fail to see that being deceived is sin in itself.
What the hell? It is a sin to be a victim? Screw that!

God turned to the snake and told him he would now be cursed to crawl around on his belly and women would hate him forever.

Fair enough, the snake was a dick in this story, he gets what he deserves. I wonder what the snake looked like before he lost his legs, is he just a salamander? Why are there still salamanders?

The punishment for women is the pain of childbirth. They also shall desire their husbands, who will rule over them.

The childbirth thing seems like a bit of an over reaction.

Wow, I love the way people try to rewrite history, Guzik says this about women
Under Jesus, some of the effects of the curse are relieved, and it has been the Christianizing of society that brought rights and dignity to women.
I'll just link to my post on what the new testament says about women and call that done. Further he comments and quotes someone else
Your desire shall be for your husband: This is true of women in a way that it is not true for men. “This verse will be understood better when it is realized that the desire of man toward his wife alone is solely by God’s grace and not by nature.” (Barnhouse)
I just live in a different universe than these people. A man's desire for his wife isn't by nature by solely by God? I'm not even sure what to say here, I just included it because I find it bizarre and interesting.

Adam's punishment for listening to Eve is that the ground will be covered in thorns and thistles and he has to work the ground.

What? Why does Eve have to deal with a bunch of pain and Adam just have to work the ground, which now happens to be covered in annoying stickers.

God made them some clothes and kicked them out of the garden to deny them the tree of life. He stationed a cherubim at the entrance with a flaming sword to keep people from going back in.

Is the garden of Eden still around? Off to google maps! Looks like there's a lot of places to check here in America, we should look for flaming swords out front.

search for "garden of eden" on google maps
For the verses of note post:


Genesis 3:4-5 God lies, the serpent tells the truth

"But the serpent said to the woman, "You will not surely die. 5 For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.""

--Properties of God--

Genesis 3:8 God walks through the garden of Eden

"And they heard the sound of the LORD God walking in the garden in the cool of the day"


  1. If you're looking for the Garden of Eden on a map, Mormons think it was at present day Jackson County Missouri (Kansas City and it's suburbs). ;)

    Anyway, as a Christian fundie, I was always taught that it was around the Tigris and Euphrates Rivers, somewhere in present day Iraq, but was destroyed by the Great Flood.

    1. Somewhere around the Tigris an Euphrates makes more sense, but I was amused at how many hits there were in america.

      Destroyed in the great flood! That's an angle I've never thought of before. Love it.

  2. Finding the tree of knowledge of good and evil would be a decent book or movie concept.

    What's the point in guarding the tree with a cherubim after the fact? Adam and Eve already know good and evil and that knowledge/curse/sin gets magically passed down the generations. What would happen if they ate from the tree again? Would they become more God-like? ...good story concept.

    1. I think the guard was for the tree of life, not the tree of knowledge.

      Although that is a good point, if you ate the fruit again what would happen? Would you gain more knowledge? If we found it we could sell the fruit as a study aid. Although I guess it isn't knowledge in general, just knowledge about good and evil. Our marketing would have to be limited to people taking ethics courses.

  3. "God called out to Adam asking him where he was, Adam responded that he hid because he was naked.

    I can imagine people asking why God would have to ask this question, and claim it shows he's not omnipotent. However, it is possible God is humoring Adam. Think of a father looking for his son in the house, he probably knows where the kid is, and still calls out for him to come out on his own."

    This explanation of why God goes "looking" for Adam only makes sense to me if what Adam had done is some minor offense and God wants to show the that he's not really that upset. You might do this with your kid if they stoled a cookie or made a small mess. You play a little game to humor them because you're not all that upset and don't want to scare your child.
    However if the kid has done something that will bring death, disease and untold suffering into the world. Something that means billions of people will have to suffer eternal torment and damnation. Something that will change their relationship with you forever. Would you really think it's reasonable for God to play a little child's game first? That just doesn't sound very likely to me.
    I find it far more plausible that the author of these verses didn't believe God to be Omnipresent, or Omniscient than to think he believed Adam had just unleashed Original Sin into the world and God decided to play hide and seek with Adam before cursing him and kicking him out of the garden.

    1. I agree with you that the much more reasonable explanation is the god described here isn't supposed to be an omni god. However, when I was a Christian I found the "God is humoring him" explanation convincing, so I assume that is accepted by many of them.


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